SteamOS e Gambas

[vuott]

Vi riporto questa discussione apparsa nella M.L. ufficiale:


" Valve just released the first beta of SteamOS, a Debian Wheezy-based
distro which runs the Steam client in Big Picture mode (designed for
televisions). SteamOS is Valve's attempt to circumvent the walled
gardens that are Microsoft Windows and Apple iOS/OSX and allow the
digital distribution of their games though Steam independent of a
locked-down OS. Their plan is to allow third party OEMs and VARs to
install SteamOS onto "steamboxes", which essentially are HTPCs (PCs
designed for the living room). Valve is developing their own custom
input devices (gamepads, etc.) for the OS and are pushing game
development studios hard to port past and future games to Linux so they
may be distributed through SteamOS.

http://linux.slashdot.org/story/13/12/14/0045211/valve-releases-debian-based-steamos-beta

I'm downloading the ISO now to test it in a VM:

magnet:?xt=urn:btih:1e4dae83371ba704d5d89e1828068ef0c4151e32&dn=SteamOSInstaller.zip&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.openbittorrent.com%3A80%2Fannounce&tr=udp%3A%2F%2Ftracker.publicbt.com%3A80%2Fannounce

http://store.steampowered.com/steamos/download/?ver=default

Currently GAMBAS can't run on iOS, OSX, Windows, Android or any game
console OSs (PS3/4, Xbox 360/One, etc.). There is a strong possibility,
especially if we contact Valve head Gabe Newell directly, that GAMBAS
will be able to run on SteamOS with GAMBAS applications being
distributed through Steam. I think it would be a serious mistake to let
this opportunity slip by while SteamOS is still in beta. It's a very
rare opportunity to increase the potential install base of GAMBAS
applications that we may not see again.

One glaring issue however may be GAMBAS's required packages and
dependencies. SteamOS is basically a console OS, meaning it is expected
to work the same way throughout its lifespan with the exception of
Valve-tested updates. I doubt Valve would allow an application to
arbitrarily install packages. Is there a way to package a GAMBAS
application such that all the dependencies and libraries are stored with
the application and not installed system-wide? It would be like a
Windows application having all it's DLLs stored in its installation
directory, ignoring the Windows system DLLs.

Kevin Fishburne "


" If SteamOS is a Debian and use the Debian package manager, you should be
able to install any Gambas program the same way as on Debian. Why do you
want to install Gambas programs the Windows way?

--
Benoît Minisini "


" I don't... I think it's a bad idea in general. What it comes down to is
whether or not Linux applications distributed through Steam must be
self-contained or are allowed to install system packages as required
dependencies. I'll have to ask Valve, but I just don't think they'd
allow it as it could produce unexpected results and potentially cause
problems with the OS. So I'm thinking either GAMBAS and its dependencies
would need to be preinstalled on SteamOS or the GAMBAS application would
need to be self-contained.

--
Kevin Fishburne "


" I think SteamOS is a great development, but let's not kid ourselves: Valve
is using Linux to push their own DRM-based app store. It's about pushing
Steam, not pushing Linux. I appreciate that they're growing the market for
Linux games, because now there's more than just Icculus porting Humble
Bundle games to Linux. But I think it's telling that they call SteamOS a
"fork" of Debian, and I certainly have no interest in assisting people who
want to create DRM-encumbered Gambas apps.

I think it's more likely that someone who wants to use a high-level
language is going to use C# or VB with Monogame, since it works on not just
Linux but everything from the iPhone to the Ouya, and the form design
advantage that Gambas provides is erased if you're using the SDL/OpenGL
components for your game.

That said, here at home, our next desktop PC will most likely be a Steambox
hooked up to our television.

As for the Gambas packaging question, since it is essentially a console OS,
if Gambas development is supported at all, in all likelihood you'll just
have whatever version of Gambas available that the version of Debian
they're based on does, and you'll need to make your code work on that.
Breaking APIs between minor releases is not going to work, so they'll
probably just pick one and freeze it.

Their beta page says "Most of all, it is an open Linux platform that leaves
you in full control. You can take charge of your system and install new
software or content as you want," and says they use apt for their own
package management. I take that to mean that you'll be able to add your own
software sources and install whatever you like, being cautious not to stomp
on Valve's own ABIs. Whether it'll be easy for your app's non-technical
audience to add your repo and install your stuff -- as easy as it is on
Win8 or OSX or Android, at least -- is another question, but one that
should become clear within the next few months.

Rob "

[Michy9393]

Anche se non vedo l'utilità di sviluppare su steam os è meglio così 

[vuott]

...continua...


" I completely agree with you as to Valve's motives. I also believe the
proverb "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" and think that applies
here. From my initial research it also appears as though Valve allows
apps to be published without DRM:

http://www.gog.com/forum/general/list_of_drmfree_games_on_steam/page1

Many independent studios release their games DRM free, which is nearly a
requirement for their market. I'm against DRM of any kind, and while
most apps on Steam have DRM I think the more apps that -don't- have it
the better the chance of turning the tide against it. Steam also now
allows applications that are not games, making the possibility of GAMBAS
apps on Steam endless.

> I think it's more likely that someone who wants to use a high-level
> language is going to use C# or VB with Monogame, since it works on not just
> Linux but everything from the iPhone to the Ouya, and the form design
> advantage that Gambas provides is erased if you're using the SDL/OpenGL
> components for your game.

That could be so, but we're all about choice and I think GAMBAS is an
excellent one. I also think a program's viability is strengthened by the
number of its users, and in turn the number of its users is increased by
the program's platform availability.

>> application such that all the dependencies and libraries are stored with
>> the application and not installed system-wide? It would be like a
>> Windows application having all it's DLLs stored in its installation
> right no? always behing the shadows of window? right?
> like windo that, like windo this..
>
> when the thing will be done in the linux way?

It would be more like Linux regressing from the Linux way to the Windows
way; taking a step backward. Linux package management has always been
light years ahead of how other OSs install software. Other than
available software, there is nothing about Windows remotely superior to
GNU/Linux. So relax, you got the wrong guy here.

Kevin Fishburne "